8.10 "Torn And Frayed" Supernatural DISCUSSION

[AntiArbitrator]

Published on Jan 15, 2013
Crowley has gone on the offense. Executive producer Jeremy Carver talks about what you can expect in Wednesday's all new Supernatural.




Promo

[SoCal]

At last! The boys are back!

But Sam looks seriously pissed. Bitchface-a-looza!

[lemongrover]

I wonder if we all starting crying "uncle" the writers would quit with the drama crap between the brothers and the horrible dialogue. I'm trying to hang onto the show, but it's becoming more and more difficult. This season is so unimpressive and slow.

And I still don't understand what the fuck they were thinking when they wrote Sam this season. Remind me to NEVER take whatever it was what they were taking when they wrote this.

I don't understand how the show could write some seriously good stuff for Castiel, Benny, Alfie, and Kevin, but go so horribly wrong with Sam and Dean. I don't know, but it's getting to the point where I just don't even what to analyze or talk about the show too much anymore.

I went easy on it and gave it a three. I'm not sure if I liked it. But if you took out the Sam and Dean drama, Amelia's godawful dialogue, awkwardness between Sam and Dean, Dean saying they didn't need Sam, no resolution between Sam and Dean (other than them staying together, which I guess is good, but I want to know it's over with and start fixing the relationship that Carver broke through OCC methods like six episodes ago), and senseless killing or ditching all characters outside of Sam and Dean (for what looks to be awhile) then the episode was good. (Basically, if you took Sam and Dean out of the episode, you would have had a great episode! And people say Castiel could handle this own show. Okay, cattiness way, but the major problems of tonight's episode came from the Winchesters for me. Bad move writers! Bad writing!)

I really hope they find a new showrunner for next season and a new writing staff. (And while they are at it, a new music guy who doesn't do soap opera music and some new directors who don't do the plot twist reveal shock face shot.)

[SoCal]

I enjoyed it.

Good drama between Dean and Sam. Glad that Kevin's mom wasn't in the episode. Why is it taking Kevin so long to deciper this stone?

Still confused about Naomi/Castiel situation.

Glad that Amelia looks to finally be out of the picture. But I hope that Benny turns up again.

Odd jump from such an angst filled episode to the one next week that looks like it's more light-hearted.

[Aeryn]

I taped it, but haven't watched it yet. Sounds like crap. I'm in no hurry to see it.

[evilsquirre1]

I'm not a fan of torture that there was a bit to much of that in this episode. Poor angel with the name I can't spell so I'll go with Afie and I'm not even sure I spelt that right.

I felt bad for Benny he was begging for Dean's help and not getting it because Sam's a whiney bitch. Too bad Leonre is gone. I can't decide who annoys me more right now. Sam whining because he isn't the number one in Dean's world or what's her bucket that is chasing him down in hotel while she has a husband at home. Although I might have to learn her name now because she made one very good point. Amelia that her name she was right Sam needs to stop stringing her along either stay with her or leave. But coming back is messing with her mind isn't right. She doesn't know Sam hunts and Dean tricked him so that is now it looks to her.

Poor Cas, he really is under complete control of heaven. Dean was pretty dumb to ice that demon before hearing what he has to say. Of course said Demon probably would have played games to live longer. So Dean did himself a favor. This episode was a nice set up to the bigger picture of the season. But I really hope they don't make Heaven just as bad as Hell. Because that would be lame.

On a side note the Actress that plays Amelia looked like she was fighting a cold. Her voice sounded sick and under her nose was red. So when she and Sam kissed I felt really bad for both actors. Being sick and working is difficult. I don't like it when I'm coworkers are sick but now I'm just relieved I don't have to kiss them while they are all snotty. Yuck! So the scene with Ameila and Sam's kiss was not hot for me in fact it grossed me out.

[ezpzy]

Evilsquirre1, I am not a fan of torture either. They seem to have amped up the torture and I hated the scenes where the demons tortured Heaven's most adorable angel. The burning bush was nice, but did it have to melt the man's face? It led to some information that makes the tablets more dangerous than I realized.

Posted by SoCal on Today at 9:15am

I enjoyed it.

Good drama between Dean and Sam. Glad that Kevin's mom wasn't in the episode. Why is it taking Kevin so long to decipher this stone?

Still confused about Naomi/Castiel situation.

Glad that Amelia looks to finally be out of the picture. But I hope that Benny turns up again.

Odd jump from such an angst filled episode to the one next week that looks like it's more light-hearted.

I enjoyed the episode too, other than the torture...

The good thing about the drama between Dean and Sam is they were honest about what they were thinking and feeling rather than sniping or refusing to talk about the real issues. I agree with Lemongrover that Sam and Dean did not resolve their issues except to stay together, which was accomplished by giving up someone they care about. Inevitable resentment.

I think Amelia has more control issues than Dean ever had. Okay Amelia, you have no idea what Sam does, but you are going to dictate the day, time, location and consequences. Stay away from her Sam! I think she is gone too.

But not Benny. It seems obvious to me that Benny is headed for trouble. Dean has to realize Benny would not have pleaded with him if it was not urgent. I think Dean gave up Benny to make up for Sam giving up Amelia. The next time we see Benny, I bet Dean will be hunting him and that will break my heart.

Anicat thinks Naomi might be the one who tortured Castiel when he was in Heaven's prison. That would account for his flashbacks. Poem I saw on Twitter today: Roses are red/Violets are blue/Naomi-fuck you.

Poor Kevin. I almost choked when Dean said Kevin's mom is "hot", but I know he was just messing with Kevin.

[novemberschild]

I am not going to rate this one yet, because I need to see it at least one more time to see how I feel.

This one had its issues and I know there are a lot of things that people didn't like about it, though I haven't had a chance to read many reviews yet.
But I think I am going to focus away from the negative and talk about the positive.
I think Amelia is gone and for me that is good, she and Sam had no chemistry and that storyline just dragged for me.
Dean told Benny that he couldn't be a friend anymore, for me that is good because I still think that Benny is up to no good and sooner or later he will do something wrong and the guys will come hunting.
I liked Cas in this one, he was allowed to show a side that we hadn't saw before, really scared. All the other angels we have seen have all shown us mostly human emotions, all but Cas, and now finally we see it.

I liked that Sam and Dean talked in this, they talked. They didn't yell and they didn't fight or throw punches at one another, they talked!.
It may have not been the best talk ever, because the dialog was a little iffy, but they tried to find a way to work thru the problems.
I believe that in order for Carver to fix the problems of the last 2 years, he had to take things further down, but now that they were so low, he can start bringing things back up, at least I hope so.
I still have hope that this season can live up to the high hopes that I had for it.

[AntiArbitrator]

Jan 17, 2013 21:25:23 GMT -5 novemberschild said:

I am not going to rate this one yet, because I need to see it at least one more time to see how I feel.

Sometimes it does take more than one viewing.

I recall wanting to revise my vote and could not; so the poll is set up with an option to retract a vote if anyone changes her mind.

[SoCal]

One good thing is that this season we get 24 episodes, right? That means we have 13 more until season's end.

[AntiArbitrator]

24 episodes sounds good to me. I hope there are no more breaks.

[SoCal]

No more breaks.... ..good one....

I think there was an episode with the title "Wishful Thinking." Sounds like that.

[waggy3015]

Am I the only one that noticed the subtle smirk Dean had on his face after Castiel's "stow your crap" line to Sam and Dean?

I thought that was funny. That and Dean's embarrassment with the porn coming up on his laptop and his "you didn't see anything" line to Cas.

[AntiArbitrator]

Hi Waggy I thought Dean trying to hide the porn was very funny. I do not remember the smirk, but I will take another look. I bet that was cute.

[novemberschild]

I think I noticed the smirk, but I need to watch one more time anyway and I will look for it.

I don't think we get 24 episodes this season only 23, that still leaves 13 episodes.
And I think there is still one more break coming up, but I don't think it is very long.

[AntiArbitrator]

This is the smirk when Cas said he would get the ingredients for the spell.



This is how he looked when Castiel said to stow their crap. Sam had a similar expression.


My favorite shot is Sam's WTH?! look when Cas appeared next to him.

[AntiArbitrator]

Things I am grateful for:
1. When Sam and Dean were fighting the demons, Castiel did not intervene and the boys were able to finish the battle.

2. More than one demon killing knife.

3. No one asked why they ran around with one knife for 5 seasons.

4. Castiel brought Sam instead of "obeying" Dean.

5. Amelia is gone. I'm surprised she didn't bring the dog and tell Sam to keep him.

6. Crowley is evil. Hey, the King of Hell is supposed to be evil.

[evilsquirre1]

Jan 18, 2013 21:45:09 GMT -5 AntiArbitrator said:

Things I am grateful for:
1. When Sam and Dean were fighting the demons, Castiel did not intervene and the boys were able to finish the battle.

2. More than one demon killing knife.

3. No one asked why they ran around with one knife for 5 seasons.

4. Castiel brought Sam instead of "obeying" Dean.

5. Amelia is gone. I'm surprised she didn't bring the dog and tell Sam to keep him.

6. Crowley is evil. Hey, the King of Hell is supposed to be evil.

What I'm thankful for:

1. The lighting in this episode showed Jared and Jensen's pretty eyes. I hate the dark shots were their eye look brown. (What I'm shallow, your surprised really?)

2. Dean let Sam make his own decision. It's nice to see Dean treating Sam like an adult.

3. Kevin sent is Mom away somewhere safe and off camera.

4. Sam chose his brother and hunting over an adulterous relationship with an annoying bitch. Dong ding the bitch is gone.

5. Benny's hot as hell voice and accent. They should use the voice for books on tape. ;D I would actually be interested in 50 shades of grey if he was reading it to me.

6. Cas or Crowley didn't get killed in this episode. After Sera's killing spee in Season seven I was worried.

[AntiArbitrator]

I like all of those too, but my heart is breaking over Benny. He needs a friend.

Want to hear something crazy? I thought Castiel was going to get Benny and bring him to help them. Don't tell anyone I thought that.

[SoCal]

Two demon-killing knives? I thought Castiel handed Sam an angel-killing sword, telling him it would kill demons, too.

[AntiArbitrator]

Jan 19, 2013 11:48:18 GMT -5 SoCal said:

Two demon-killing knives? I thought Castiel handed Sam an angel-killing sword, telling him it would kill demons, too.

Technicality.
2. More than one demon killing knife that will kill demons.

[novemberschild]

I have watched this one 3 times now and I gave it a 2, it did have some decent moments.
In watching this several times I have also realized that either there is something that we saw that I missed or I didn't pick up on something that was a key point.
I feel like I missed something or they didn't stress it enough for me to pick up on, does anyone else feel like that?
I just feel like something was missing and I can't put my finger on it.

[SoCal]

Wow....only a 2....I gave it a four. Liked the drama between Dean and Sam; liked that Amelia seems to be gone; liked the dis-connect between Benny and Dean.

Still confilicted about Naomi.

[yimhappy]

No way would I ever want to be a character on SPN. Poor Cas and Alfie. I'm glad I'm no longer emotionally invested, otherwise that would have been upsetting. The camera work was over the top when DA DUM - Wow! an Angel tablet exists.

I'm glad Kevin's mom wasn't in this epi too.

I didn't think Amelia was that boring, grading on a curve because what I saw of S7 was incredibly boring. Amelia was something different at least. Amelia/Sam was something I haven't seen a dozen times before. Also, I was actually interested a bit in Dean was acting with Benny, Sam, Cas.

I will hand this to Carver. Last year, no one really cared about the Leviathans, even after Bobby died. But this year, well it didn't take a major character death to get fans invested in the fight against Naomi, just Alfie, who only reflected what is loved about the main characters.

[yimhappy]

I had to share this Tumblr link. It is so worth reading. Someone's dad, clueless about SPN, watched this epi. I loved his comments. For me, TFW will forever be...
Sam = Hippie
Dean = Perv
Cas = Columbo

iwillbebackintenyears.tumblr.com/post/41934108514/my-dad-watches-torn-and-frayed

[AntiArbitrator]

Feb 12, 2013 17:13:27 GMT -5 yimhappy said:

I had to share this Tumblr link. It is so worth reading. Someone's dad, clueless about SPN, watched this epi. I loved his comments. For me, TFW will forever be...
Sam = Hippie
Dean = Perv
Cas = Columbo

iwillbebackintenyears.tumblr.com/post/41934108514/my-dad-watches-torn-and-frayed

Those are the funniest episode comments I have ever read. I think he has your girl beat.

[yimhappy]

Feb 12, 2013 18:32:38 GMT -5 AntiArbitrator said:

Those are the funniest episode comments I have ever read. I think he has your girl beat.

My girl?? Who is this girl who is beat?? ~is clueless~


Also, let me share one of my fave Tumblrs below. This blogger's SPN metas are really well written, clear, and knowledgeable. She's fluent in greek myths and story structure, and the kind of stuff I wanted to know about once I discovered SPN. Plus, she's positive, upbeat, increases my enjoyment, such as it is. She does get hyperbolic at times. Plus I don't agree with all of her opinions. But she sure makes me think.

flutiebear.tumblr.com/supernaturalmeta

[AntiArbitrator]

Yim, I could not think of her name at first, but it is Lucifan. She would write the funny recaps.

[yimhappy]

Feb 12, 2013 22:52:55 GMT -5 AntiArbitrator said:

Yim, I could not think of her name at first, but it is Lucifan. She would write the funny recaps.

Good memory!
I think that this guy and Lucifan are comparable. But this guy might be ahead because he says it in few words.

God damn. SPN fandom. I miss you.