Re: The Castiel Skeptics Society

[Aeryn]

[DeanandSam]

I read all the theories about the Jefferry and Demon thing was a reference to Dean and Cas. I don't think it was I think it was a parallel to Sam and Lucifur. Just like Jefferey let the Demon back in, Sam at the end let Lucifur back in. I will never ever buy in to the theories the Desitel shippers make because they always end their posts about they are foreshadowing that Dean and Castiel will be canon, I mean really? NO! I was buying your post about it being about Dean/Cas and you just had to go and say that? I can't buy into theories made by crazed Desitel shippers, I just can't. So, in my head, it makes more sense about it being about Sam/Lucifur, other reviewers saw it like that as well.

[ravanne]

You can draw parallels between Jeffrey and most of the characters, but for me Jeffrey's line about happiness laying in a life with purpose was aimed more at Dean. Dean's floundering had been because he's lost his sense of purpose in life and doesn't see the point of hunting (considering that there's always a new big bad to fight). Not sure how helpful getting that very solid bit of advice is coming from a deranged serial killer demon groupie like Jeffrey.

I don't think that anything about Jeffrey can really apply to Sam because Sam has already grappled with the darkness within him and come to terms with his faults that lead to so many problem. Sam didn't let Lucifer back in because he wanted Lucifer's help or power. It was accidental, just something that happened without thinking because Lucifer was able to wear him down. I did find it interesting that Lucifer remained in the scene at the library after Sam already exited, which is leading me to suspect that Lucifer is more than just a mental hallucination on Sam's part, but that's speculation for another thread.

A parallel with Castiel and Jeffrey is more obvious, especially since Dean was the one who interacted most closely with both. And in both cases Dean misread the signs of who and what he was really dealing with. He mistakes a meek appearance for the individual actually being meek and harmless and it's come back to bite him in the ass on more than a few occasions. Like Jeffrey, Castiel wanted the power (tired of being the weakest angel who got its ass kicked by its older and more powerful siblings on a regular basis) and was not willing to give that power up until it became clear that it was not able to contain it. Then it goes running back to Dean begging for help. Jeffrey liked being possessed because it gave him a power that he never had on his own. And in both cases, Dean's instincts failed him and he left himself vulnerable because he didn't see the threat coming from that direction.

[lucifan]

Just posting the recent two recaps I did.


Recap Episode 7.14 “Plucky Pennywhistle’s Magical Menagerie”
(Original Title: Cracky Sammygrapefruit’s Countdown to Satanerie).

Ten

“Hey Frank, any sign of Dick?”

“Nope, still Dickless.”

“Oh come on! When am I gonna get Dick already! I’m starved for a good Dick pounding . . .what’s so funny Sam?”

“Nothin.”

Sam doesn’t have the elusive, slippery Dick, but he does have another job: A man killed by a giant vampire octopus.
The victim’s wife suggests he was having an affair with the nanny.
Looking but not touching, Dean (by himself, since Sam is currently making questionable lodging choices) interviews the nanny. She tells him about dad not showing up to his own daughter's birthday party at “Plucky’s”, and the boogie octopus that lives in the girl’s closet.

Dean calls his bro to tell him what he found out. Sam, answering from inside a tiki-themed motel room (the kind only couples on their honeymoon would go to. . . .) spits out his umbrella drink.

“P-Plucky’s?! I don’t like the sound of that. . .sounds like a place where. . .where. . .c-clowns hang out!” Sam shivers.

Nine

A man gets nailed through a fence. Horse prints are found nearby. At first, Dean thinks that someone who works at Medieval Times got a little carried away, that is until he finds the drawing the victim’s son made after he got humiliated at Plucky’s.
Dean looks sadly upon the unicorn drawing.

“*sniff sniff* This picture reminds me of Cass. *sniff sniff*”

“You mean because of the rainbow coming out of its a$$?”

“No.”

“Because it stabbed the guy in the back?”

“No.”

"Because when it talks, it doesn’t make any sense?"

"No."

"Because when you talk, it doesn't look like it understands what you're saying?"

"No."

"Because it smells?"

"No."

“Because it's got a big butt?”

"No."

"Because it's got a big butt with hair coming out of it?"

"No."

"Because you can ride it places."

"No."

"Ok, I give up."

“Because it has a hard thing sticking out of it. . .”

“*Groan!*”

“Look here Sammy. Another death tied to that Plucky’s place. You know what that means. . .”

“I-It means we get out of here and forget I ever mentioned the vampopus?”

“No. It means you have to investigate Plucky’s all by yourself.”

“What! Why can’t you go with me?”

“Because I’m pretending to do something else. Bye!” Dean runs away.

Eight

As Sam feared, Plucky’s was a polka-dot draped, grease paint crusted, red nose squeaking, pie flinging, cotton candy reeking, clown den. He knew he should have put on a pair of pull-ups before he left. Crawling around on the floor to avoid the scary clowns, Sam notices a wall where children’s drawings are hanging. The theme was “worse fears” and shockingly not a single clown pic among them. While he makes his own drawing on a place mat, something that makes him feel safe to calm his nerves (Satan), the janitor hints that he might have some information, and tells Sam to meet him later. Unfortunately, later turns out to be never. A late night ball pit cleaning ends with the janitor getting sucked up like a giant tapioca pearl in a glass of bubble tea.

“All those balls, but no Dick . . .”

“Dean, I don’t want to go back to the clown place!!”

“Don’t worry, Sam. This time I’m coming with you. You’re gonna do your best Horatio Cain impression and bad cop all the employees, while I pose as a guy who looks way too cute to be a child peeper, but whose presence can't be explained any other way. I'll see if they do anything suspicious after you’re done with them.”

"Why oh why did it have to be clowns. . ."

Seven

Dean strolls around, looking for something to entertain himself with while Sam interrogates the suspects. He walks up to the prize booth and gets a gander at Howard who is not a clown, yet wears a clown shirt, has a clown voice, and clown smiles a lot. Dean, mouth agape, silently points his finger towards him.

“You. . .”

“Yyyeeeeeeeessss?”

“. . .Give me that giant rainbow slinky.”

“Nooooooooo, hee-hee.”

Apparently, among the Winchester list of hunting rules such as “If it bleeds, you can kill it”, “It’s never just the wind”, “Two weird things don’t happen independently of each other”, “All monsters are irredeemable freaks who should be killed without mercy. . .except Sam” and “Angels are lying, two-timing bastards”, there isn't one that says “It’s always the creepy guy.”

Howard, the guy you immediately knew was the one responsible, goes to the interrogation room. Dean, meanwhile, tries to win enough tickets to get the giant rainbow slinky for chod knows what purpose. As Dean plays with his skee-balls, he meets little Tyler who is feeling dejected because his mother, who works at Plucky’s, doesn’t have any time for him.

“So what if your moms feeds you nothing but crappy Plucky pizza and leaves you with nothing to do all day, but draw giant killer robots that shoot death rays out of their eyes. . .it could be worse. . .your mother could be burning on the ceiling.”

Tyler slowly backs away.

Dean notices that Howard has already returned from questioning.

“What up Sam? You barely spent any time with him.”

“He’s clowny! He’s like the kind of guy you just know does evil creepy things involving children. So yeah, he’s totally not him. All I got left is Aslan over there.” Sam points to the guy in the lion suit who starts immediately running away.

They drop kick his furry butt across the parking lot and after they insist that they don’t care about his meth lab past, he tells them about the weird noises coming from the basement. And just so Sam has to be all by himself again, they discover that Tyler’s drawing of the terminator robot has disappeared.

Six, Five, Four, Three, Two

Sam follows Tyler and his mom in case they get attacked by Megatron. It doesn't take long before the worse possible thing that could ever happen to Sam, happens. And if you guessed going to hell and being tortured, forcibly spooned, and driven mad by the devil was it, you would not even be close. IT'S CLOWNS!

"F-feeling the l-last remnants of sanity f-fading awaaaay. . ."

As Sam is getting clown banged by Murder and Killy, Dean checks out the basement at Plucky's and finds a magic altar and doodle shrine. Howard shows up while Dean is fondling his clown dolls. Can you believe it was him all along? It seems Howard had crappy parents whose neglect resulted in his twin brother drowning, so now he helps out other little children with crappy parents by leaving them with a lifetime of therapy bills. Dean tells Howard to go Pluck himself and gives him a taste of his own medicine. He throws a drawing of his drowning brother into the fiery altar making him come to life. After Howard gets turned into a human seltzer bottle, the evil clowns attacking Sam disappear. . .but the damage is already done!

One

“I got you a giant rainbow slinky,” Sam says twitching and drooling.

“Awww thanks Sammy. I’m gonna have some fun alone times with this thing. Here, I got you something too.”

Dean throws a clown doll at Sam.

“Clooowwwwwns!! ”

“Oh come on Sammy. You got over seeing Satan everywhere and Bobbay dying. Are you really going to lose it over a bunch of clowns from a kid’s drawing?”

“Sure am.”

“I guess I can’t relate. Awesome me is just not afraid of anything.”

“Hey look Dean, I drew a picture of Satan repeatedly punching you in the face, I think I’m going to make a little trip to the basement.”

“*Gasp*!”

[lucifan]

Recap Episode 7.15 “Repo Man”
(Original Title: Silence of the Sams)

After the Tiki room fiasco, Dean decides to choose the accommodations this time around. He finds a nice urinal themed motel to set up DICC (Dick Interception Command Center).

“Frank, give me what I need. . .What?! Oh, come on! Guys like me and Sam should not have this much trouble finding Dick!”

Too bad you’re not in hell anymore. You never had any trouble finding Dick there.

Sam quickly presses his boo-boo, the slowest healing wound since Chod created man.

“Hey, Dean I’ve got something that can distract us from our long Dick drought. . .Look, Serial Killings!” Sam shows Dean a bunch of gruesome crime scene photos, “and they have the same MO as the murders that happened four years ago when we met our first demon serial killer. He possessed a guy name Jeffery, remember him? We called him Jeffery Dehmer.”

“Four years ago. . .you mean, back when the Big Bad actually had more relevance than your current hair style or my never-ending man pain? ”

Mmm-hmm, when are you guys going to learn: you can’t top Satan! . . .except maybe with clowns. . . Like that one, standing right behind you.

“AAAAAAAhhh!”

“Sammy?”

“. . .I’m out of granola bars, oh the horror.”

*
Sam’s suspicions are confirmed when they find demon droppings at the latest crime scene. Looks like their demon serial killer is back.

“Stop giving me tongue!”

“Stop giving you tongue? When did I start, Sammy?”

“I wasn’t talking to you.”

“Who then?” Dean looks around

“. . .Nobody.”

“Saaaaaaaaaam!”

“Sa. . .tuhn.”

“Huh?”

“Sutton! Detective Sutton! He’s been making lewd gestures at me ever since we got here.”

“Really?. . .He was a little bit too enthusiastic to see us, now that you mention it. Don’t you worry Sammy, I’m gonna tell that perv to stop undressing you with his eyes. ”

“Uuuh . .”

*

Sam and Dean pay a visit to Nora, the wiccan lady who helped them with the original case. She suggests they check up on Jeffery. Sweet, innocent, kind of creepy Jeffery is currently in a half way house. After Jeffy was beaten like a Satan angering Winchester, and exorcized, he made the tiny mistake of telling normal people that his subsequent alcoholism was the result of a demon Hannibal Lecter inhabiting his body. Unsurprisingly, he was locked away like a seasons four, five, six, and soon to be seven Sammy. But he’s just great now. He even got himself a cute doggy (they sure would). Although he’s back to his old stamp collecting self, he can still vividly remember the entire list of women the demon had planned to kill four years ago as if he had just murdered one of them himself yesterday. The next one on the list was a librarian named Marjorie.

“Great! Sammy you go tackle Buffalo Bill all by yourself at the library while I’ll stay here with Jeffery to make sure he’s safe.”

“But. . .the demon is only targeting women. . .”

You don’t need Dean, you got me.

“. . .”

You’ll see, I’ll be the most helpful partner in Supernatural history!


*
At the library. . .

How can anyone believe you’re an FBI agent with those prehistoric- sized mutton chops and Jesus hair?

Sam looks over at Marjorie.

And what’s with these Leviathans, huh? It’s like someone Jefferson Starshipped the evil of a demon, the douchebaginess of an angel, the appetite of a rugaru, and the bloated ego of Castiel to make one giant crap villain cocktail.

Sam looks at his notes.

And what is with Dean being tired all the time? Is he getting enough iron? Does he have malaria?

Sam looks back at Marjorie.

Trench coat.

Sam rolls his eyes.

Clowns.

Sam shifts uncomfortably in his seat.

Becky.

“Would you stop, already!”

Come on, let me help.

“No!”

Let me help, or I’ll make everyone in this library reenact every episode of season six, with a special double encore presentation of “the man who would be king”.

“You wouldn’t.”

Some man suddenly stands up from his chair and says with a monotone voice “In the beginning there was me. . .”

“OK, Ok! Here’s the case file!”

*Satan looks at the case file* Well duh, Sam, why does a demon need to drug people. It sounds like something a creepy human would do.

“Oh no, Jeffery!”

It’s always the creepy guy.

Sam repeatedly tries to call Dean, but he doesn’t answer.

I guess Dean’s not tired anymore. . .Get it? Cause he’s dead! Har Har Haaaar!


*
Sagny and Lucy snoop around Jeffery’s room and find a demon summoning ritual. Satan points out the familiar hand writing: It’s Nora’s!

Sam goes to her place. While he and Lucy talk about the pain in the a$$ that is older brothers, Nora sneaks up behind Sam and wacks him in the grapefruit.

*Lucy lets out a high pitch sonic screech that shatters all the windows*

“What the hell was that?!”

That’s how we say ouch in angel.

Sam questions Nora, but she isn’t being too forthcoming with an explanation. It’s not helping that Sam is talking to himself and repeatedly referencing Satan.

Burn this witch, Sammy!

“That’s horrible. I’m not gonna burn her.”

Then just punch her in the face over and over again, preferably to the music of Def Leopard.

“Ok.”

Sam punches Nora in the face while playing “Pour Some Sugar on Me”. She eventually spills the beans though it can’t be certain if it was due to the punching and not the music. She tells them that Jeffery has kidnapped her son, and is forcing her to help him summon the same demon that Sam and Dean sent back to hell four years ago.

Awwww, he wants his demon back. Why can’t you be romantic like that?

*
Meanwhile. . .

Dean who fell for the ol’ “I just remembered where the demon serial killer’s special killing place is. Let’s go take a look” line, now finds himself tied up next to Nora’s one-eared son. Jeffery is preparing the demon summoning ritual (one parts each of blood of the exorcist and cute doggy heart). Once he says the magic words, his demon boyfriend appears. Only he doesn’t return in his body, he returns in Nora son’s body. That two timing bastard!
Deffery start dancing together.

“*sniff sniff* It’s like how me and Cass used to be before he turned into a puddle of bird poop *sniff sniff*”

But Jeffery is upset: he didn’t need a partner for dancing with the stars, he wanted to be possessed again! His dembeau tells him he already Master Yoda’d him in the forces of darkness, so there is nothing left to teach. In other words, he’s done with his a$$. Jeffery gets clingy, forcing his ex to pummel him to the ground for his own good.

“*sniff sniff* Oh memories! Why did you leave me Cass? *sob*”

Sam and Satan to the rescue!

Sam distracts Deffery, giving Dean the opportunity to Houdini himself out of his bonds. The demon chases Sam, getting suckered into a devil’s trap made on the ceiling.

“How the hell did you have time to draw that?!”

“With a paint sprayer and an enormo devil trap stencil?”

Nora exorcises the demon from her son and Dean caps Jeffery.

“Wow, Sam good work! How in the hell were you able to figure everything out? Did you find someone to do research for you or something?”

Satan winks at Sam.


*
Back at the urinal, Dean plops down on his bed face first in exhaustion. Sitting captive in a chair all day is very, very tiring. He is going straight to sleep and no amount of strange noises will make him turn his head to look at Sammy.

Well that was fun. See, I was useful, wasn’t I? So you can just smother Dean with a pillow now since you don’t need him anymore.

“Ok, boo-boo time.”

Sam presses his boo-boo

*Satan turns down the lights. . .Barry White music starts playing*

Sam presses his boo-boo harder.

*Sam suddenly finds himself in a white nightie*

Sam taps furiously at his boo-boo.

It’s spooning tiiime.

“Aaaaaaaahhh, oh God!”

“Sam, I don’t know what you’re doing back there, but whatever it is, don’t be doing it in the same room as me. Take it to the bathroom!. . .And run the water!”

Hey Sam, tell Dean I found Dick.

[CaptainBill]

Apparently, among the Winchester list of hunting rules such as “If it bleeds, you can kill it”, “It’s never just the wind”, “Two weird things don’t happen independently of each other”, “All monsters are irredeemable freaks who should be killed without mercy. . .except Sam” and “Angels are lying, two-timing bastards”, there isn't one that says “It’s always the creepy guy.”

Oh Lucifan, the girl after my own heart!

[shadowhund]

Hi Bill!!!

All clear around your home base?


What do you think what should Dean do with the dirty trenchcoat? Put it in the laundery and keep the bill and throw it in the face of the vessel of this creature?
Should he cut the trenchcoat in long tatters and tie down the bad people in SPN, so he would spare the money for buying ropes?
Should Dean dry his tears with the trenchcoat? He might get some germs then!
Should Dean take the trenchcoat for cleaning his hands while working on the impala?
Should he burn it?
Should he cover himself with it while sleeping?
Should he spit on it?

Any other ideas?
I think he shouldn't have pulled it out from the water! I will not forget that Dean threw the amulet away and kept the trenchcoat!

[shadowhund]

I copied this from another forum I wrote there!

Hi skeptics,


.....we all know what Castiel has done!! We know it and no matter what, he has to take that responsibility!
We know that he worked with the angels, putting a wedge between Sam and Dean. We know that he could spy them all the time! We know that hewas only introduced as friend to Sam, because some people complained and so they let him say "Sam is my friend" That was so wrong wrong wrong! We know that he takes advantage of the situation that Sam (soulless) worked for Crowley and he knew it was wrong! We don't know whether he knew that he brought Sam back without soul, my own thininking says he knew it. How couldn't he? He pulled Dean's soul out and put it back into the body. Her he took Sam's body out of (?) and in the same time he should have felt that there was something missing!!

Its exactly how they trashed John so much that JDM even said so (!) and what he said abut John is exactly what came across in the early seasons, they do the same with Castiel.....white washing...very...very...whitewashing......and with John they did the contrary.....trashing....trashing....trashing.....We know how John was...we know it..no matter how they trash him now for some story telling, and they do exactly the same with Castiel. His origin purpose was to drive the edge more between Sam and Dean. And seen from the outside in introducing "angels" magical beings from heavenly fathers yada yada yada did something to some fans. Connecting the angels with Dean did some things to some fans and they were now in the seventh heaven with that storyline. Add to this the "righteous man" and the feathers the wings and some fans got a heart attack alone from this. I think it could have been every other angel who is passable goo looking, even Zachariah could have been this type, take away the sarcasm, the irony, the zynical wordings, his attitude. If he would have seen in Dean the savior of the heavenly garrison every angel of this series could have given this to the episodes. But this angel Castiel changed a lot in the series. Sometimes (in season 5) he was a stupid child like being) in season 6 he worked competely his own agenda and didn't care.

So whatever comes across my screen it won't change, because I have a memory like an elephant regarding this creature. I might only forgive him when all the things he did to the brothers, to part them, and ESPECIALLY to Sam not only the breaking down of the wall, way way more how he handled Sam over the whole time. I want a real redemption regarding Sammy!!! Thats the only thing I want to see from this angel thing!!!

[CaptainBill]

Hi shadowgirl, [modified because TMI personal rant and tangent about stupid teenage boys] ....Obviously I didn't manage myself so well, doing better since then.

What should Dean do with the fucking trenchcoat? I don't give a flying rat's ass anymore because when I saw this tee shirt that said, "I didn't say it was your fault, I said I am going to blame you." and I realized my first thought was, is that Cas or is that Dean? Castiel’s MO is to set a building on fire and stand outside the burning building assigning blame to firefighters while said
firefighters die.

In my experience blame are used to exert control and maintain power.

I'm going to go calm down because obviously I still on edge and freaking myself up. It's like I see Chris Brown everywhere. Stupid teenage boys!

[shadowhund]

Mar 5, 2012 19:51:36 GMT -5 CaptainBill said:

Hi shadowgirl, [modified because TMI personal rant and tangent about stupid teenage boys] ....Obviously I didn't manage myself so well, doing better since then.

What should Dean do with the fucking trenchcoat? I don't give a flying rat's ass anymore because when I saw this tee shirt that said, "I didn't say it was your fault, I said I am going to blame you." and I realized my first thought was, is that Cas or is that Dean? Castiel’s MO is to set a building on fire and stand outside the burning building assigning blame to firefighters while said
firefighters die.

In my experience blame are used to exert control and maintain power.

I'm going to go calm down because obviously I still on edge and freaking myself up. It's like I see Chris Brown everywhere. Stupid teenage boys!

"Castiel's MO is to set a building on fire and stand outside the burning building assigning blame to firefighters while said firefighters die".

A great allegory for Castiel...He did all those things and then put the blame on the humans! How can they re-introduce him and make him a friend again without loosing their balls? They are probably cowards!

Soapy terrain, slippery slope could break SPN the neck!

[spoilerwolf]

Thanks to percysowner for the info

Castiel has risen! The beloved Supernatural character played by Misha Collins will make his long-awaited return to The CW series on March 23 for the first of at least three episodes — and we've got your exclusive first look. Collins tells TV Guide Magazine that he is still playing Castiel, despite the fact that when we last saw him in the fall his body had been taken over — and destroyed — by the Leviathans.

Cas is not returning as a Leviathan, Collins says, but "he has changed." Whatever he is, Dean [Jensen Ackles, pictured above at right with Collins] sure is glad to see him. Between Bobby's demise and "Sam [being] in really dire straits," Collins says, "Dean is definitely looking to lean on the character for help." It seems Castiel is no longer the Winchester brothers' enemy.

"There's a kind of big experience that is being kicked off at the end of my first episode," Collins reveals. "Cas is going to go through yet another transformation and on to another kind of struggle and journey. Once again, he'll be put through the wringer."

So how was being back on the Supernatural set after a six-month absence? "Funny and kind of bizarre," Collins says. "It was like the entire production was frozen in time." As for appearances in Season 8 (should the show be renewed), "there's no reason why it couldn't happen," he says. "I have been resurrected from the dead around four times. So no amount of death or destruction seems to be insurmountable in the Supernatural universe."

I'm saying it now: Dean welcomes Cas back with open arms, i'm done with Dean's character. MASSIVE betrayal of his brother for forgiving the asshole who tore down his brother's wall JUST for a DISTRACTION.

I'm not lucky enough for Dean to stab him - but he damn well shouldn't be "leaning on him" - HE DID THIS TO SAM IN THE FIRST PLACE DEAN! YOU IDIOT!

Grrrrrrr!!

[ravanne]

I don't think that there are enough profanities in enough languages to state just how outraged I am. This is exactly what I was afraid of. Everything that Castiel's done is just going to be whitewashed and handwaved away. And Dean's behavior makes me absolutely sick. He held a grudge against Sam for months before finally forgiving him for the mistake he'd made. But Castiel? Welcomed with open arms. Doesn't seem to matter that Sam is in the situation he's in as a direct result of Castiel's actions. Or that Bobby died as a result. Castiel is "change" and all is forgotten (I can't say forgiven since nothing that Castiel ever does seems to stick so there's nothing to forgive).

The worst part of all this is that Sam yet again is the outsider in this little love fest, the Destiel fans are being rewarded for their delusions and Dean's IQ continues to plummet. Oh, and Sam's story... think we can forget about that being examined in any meaningful way.

Don't think I need to say this, but I am very, very unhappy now.

Think that I'm going to need some very strong alchohol to get through the rest of this season.

[chloekins]

Mar 9, 2012 10:34:51 GMT -5 ravanne said:

I don't think that there are enough profanities in enough languages to state just how outraged I am. This is exactly what I was afraid of. Everything that Castiel's done is just going to be whitewashed and handwaved away. And Dean's behavior makes me absolutely sick. He held a grudge against Sam for months before finally forgiving him for the mistake he'd made. But Castiel? Welcomed with open arms. Doesn't seem to matter that Sam is in the situation he's in as a direct result of Castiel's actions. Or that Bobby died as a result. Castiel is "change" and all is forgotten (I can't say forgiven since nothing that Castiel ever does seems to stick so there's nothing to forgive).

The worst part of all this is that Sam yet again is the outsider in this little love fest, the Destiel fans are being rewarded for their delusions and Dean's IQ continues to plummet. Oh, and Sam's story... think we can forget about that being examined in any meaningful way.

Don't think I need to say this, but I am very, very unhappy now.

Think that I'm going to need some very strong alchohol to get through the rest of this season.

I hear ya Ravanne. I'm beyond disgusted too. I'm thinking I'll record the Cas eps and decide later whether to watch or not. As far as Sam goes, I never expected to see any focus on him so am not surprised at all. When I saw how it was at the beginning of the season that they intended only to shown us that Lucifer represents Sam's torment instead of actually showing us anything I knew they didn't intend to delve deeply into what Sam suffered in hell. They never have shown us his POV so why would they start now. And after Cas returns Sam will return to standing silently in the corner so moron Dean can gave adoringly at his beloved.

[percysowner]

BTW, Spoiler TV is having a poll on who is your favorite character Dean, Sam or Castiel. Castiel is beating BOTH boys. I haven't voted because my heart is with Sam (who has the fewest votes, of course), but I figure Dean has the best chance of of beating the featherbag, so I'm holding off for a while, then I'll either vote with my heart or with my head. But please go over and give the REAL heart of the show some support. Otherwise, this will be used as a club to get Cas back on the show.

[jadezepplin]

Mar 9, 2012 10:34:51 GMT -5 ravanne said:

I don't think that there are enough profanities in enough languages to state just how outraged I am. This is exactly what I was afraid of. Everything that Castiel's done is just going to be whitewashed and handwaved away. And Dean's behavior makes me absolutely sick. He held a grudge against Sam for months before finally forgiving him for the mistake he'd made. But Castiel? Welcomed with open arms. Doesn't seem to matter that Sam is in the situation he's in as a direct result of Castiel's actions. Or that Bobby died as a result. Castiel is "change" and all is forgotten (I can't say forgiven since nothing that Castiel ever does seems to stick so there's nothing to forgive).


The worst part of all this is that Sam yet again is the outsider in this little love fest, the Destiel fans are being rewarded for their delusions and Dean's IQ continues to plummet. Oh, and Sam's story... think we can forget about that being examined in any meaningful way.

Don't think I need to say this, but I am very, very unhappy now.

Think that I'm going to need some very strong alchohol to get through the rest of this season.

I agree. Is this really happening? I'm soooo damn livid. What a turn-off. I'm so disappointed. Glad to see him and leaning on him?!? The only reason they brought this fool back is because of those Destiel fanatics. Why else would they bring him back? This is ridiculous. I can't look forward to this. Meanwhile, Sam in a psychward... I can't deal with this. Pass the strong alcohol , I'm gonna need it too!

[Lostcause]

Humm, well. They also said this season was going to have a very Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid air about it. I've not felt it really.

In fact a lot of what they have promised us, the viewers, in the past as far as plot movement goes, have not come true.

So as far as Dean leaning on Cas - let's wait and see I say. I can't imagine Dean breaking out in a huge smile upon seeing the reason why his brother is in the loony bin.

[windykl]

i agree with all of the above! where is the brother relationship i fell in love with? i don't even recognize dean anymore...and sam is pushed aside...so what was the whole point of "killing" cas off in ep 2 only to bring him back?

[shadowhund]

Mar 9, 2012 10:34:51 GMT -5 ravanne said:

I don't think that there are enough profanities in enough languages to state just how outraged I am. This is exactly what I was afraid of. Everything that Castiel's done is just going to be whitewashed and handwaved away. And Dean's behavior makes me absolutely sick. He held a grudge against Sam for months before finally forgiving him for the mistake he'd made. But Castiel? Welcomed with open arms. Doesn't seem to matter that Sam is in the situation he's in as a direct result of Castiel's actions. Or that Bobby died as a result. Castiel is "change" and all is forgotten (I can't say forgiven since nothing that Castiel ever does seems to stick so there's nothing to forgive).

The worst part of all this is that Sam yet again is the outsider in this little love fest, the Destiel fans are being rewarded for their delusions and Dean's IQ continues to plummet. Oh, and Sam's story... think we can forget about that being examined in any meaningful way.

Don't think I need to say this, but I am very, very unhappy now.

Think that I'm going to need some very strong alchohol to get through the rest of this season.

oh yeah, Ravanne I hear you too!!!

Sorry for my rant, I have to write this down...
We get kicked with the favorite Winchester and we get shoved in our throats that the people can talk to him more and relate to him more and like him more and in the same time Sam is not around, standing in the corner, silently, all alone!! Even Dean is not talking with him. Dean has his own things going on and meets and greets everyone on the planet, seemingly including his "BB" and "lost brother" Castiel!

Sam OTOH is quiete about himself, about what is going on with him and we even don't get scenes where someone talks with him about him or gives a reaction to the person, they disconnecting Sam from the viewers!!

I am now at this point that I don't need Dean to be around Sam anymore, Dean can go with Castiel elsewhere and lean on him for support, when I get equal time with Sam's journey, troubles, insight in him, people around him who care for Sam, loves him, likes him and he can have human connections! I don't care for hell memories I want to see Sam forefront and equal!

Sadly for me is the fact I don't need Dean around Sam anymore, when they don't talk with each other like brothers/family they once were...

I also thought that when they stopped thinking and caring about Sam, the character (the writers, showrunners), let him be at least the big bad lonesome wolf next year, so he has impact and Jared has something to do (but I don't know how I would handle this scenario). Then he can kill Castiel with his powers, and Dean can hunt him down finally for hurting his touchy-feely new family! Yes, am sarcastic!

But maybe we get Dean back being a brother and stone number one to Sam! But that would mean Dean would have to be at his brothers side and really looking at him and asking him and talking WITH him! Because I can only find out about Sam when Dean talks to him, or Lucifer! They have no clue how else they could give us Sam insight or they don't want to or they simply don't care!

Maybe Dean has changed when he was in hell that much that he is regretting that he ever made the deal in the first place! And he is resenting Sam for this, not openly, but in some weird brain connection!

And I say this even when I think the brothers relationship is the heart of the show, but the heart is dead and not nurtured since a long time on my screen!

[chloekins]

Mar 10, 2012 7:48:12 GMT -5 shadowhund said:

Mar 9, 2012 10:34:51 GMT -5 ravanne said:

I don't think that there are enough profanities in enough languages to state just how outraged I am. This is exactly what I was afraid of. Everything that Castiel's done is just going to be whitewashed and handwaved away. And Dean's behavior makes me absolutely sick. He held a grudge against Sam for months before finally forgiving him for the mistake he'd made. But Castiel? Welcomed with open arms. Doesn't seem to matter that Sam is in the situation he's in as a direct result of Castiel's actions. Or that Bobby died as a result. Castiel is "change" and all is forgotten (I can't say forgiven since nothing that Castiel ever does seems to stick so there's nothing to forgive).

The worst part of all this is that Sam yet again is the outsider in this little love fest, the Destiel fans are being rewarded for their delusions and Dean's IQ continues to plummet. Oh, and Sam's story... think we can forget about that being examined in any meaningful way.

Don't think I need to say this, but I am very, very unhappy now.

Think that I'm going to need some very strong alchohol to get through the rest of this season.

oh yeah, Ravanne I hear you too!!!

Sorry for my rant, I have to write this down...
We get kicked with the favorite Winchester and we get shoved in our throats that the people can talk to him more and relate to him more and like him more and in the same time Sam is not around, standing in the corner, silently, all alone!! Even Dean is not talking with him. Dean has his own things going on and meets and greets everyone on the planet, seemingly including his "BB" and "lost brother" Castiel!

Sam OTOH is quiete about himself, about what is going on with him and we even don't get scenes where someone talks with him about him or gives a reaction to the person, they disconnecting Sam from the viewers!!

I am now at this point that I don't need Dean to be around Sam anymore, Dean can go with Castiel elsewhere and lean on him for support, when I get equal time with Sam's journey, troubles, insight in him, people around him who care for Sam, loves him, likes him and he can have human connections! I don't care for hell memories I want to see Sam forefront and equal!

Sadly for me is the fact I don't need Dean around Sam anymore, when they don't talk with each other like brothers/family they once were...

I also thought that when they stopped thinking and caring about Sam, the character (the writers, showrunners), let him be at least the big bad lonesome wolf next year, so he has impact and Jared has something to do (but I don't know how I would handle this scenario). Then he can kill Castiel with his powers, and Dean can hunt him down finally for hurting his touchy-feely new family! Yes, am sarcastic!

But maybe we get Dean back being a brother and stone number one to Sam! But that would mean Dean would have to be at his brothers side and really looking at him and asking him and talking WITH him! Because I can only find out about Sam when Dean talks to him, or Lucifer! They have no clue how else they could give us Sam insight or they don't want to or they simply don't care!

Maybe Dean has changed when he was in hell that much that he is regretting that he ever made the deal in the first place! And he is resenting Sam for this, not openly, but in some weird brain connection!

And I say this even when I think the brothers relationship is the heart of the show, but the heart is dead and not nurtured since a long time on my screen!

Shadow this is excellent. I agree 100%. I'm so mad at Dean right now so I'm with you. Let Dean go off with his soul mate Cas and leave Sam alone. Sam will be better off by himself. If the writers are trying to make us sympathetic to Dean's suffering they're failing or Jensen is because he's coming across as just totally selfish.

I'm mourning so much the wonderful brotherness and magical relationship between Sam and Dean from early days. It's gone and doesn't seem likely to come back. The writers are so stupid to throw that away for their new star of the show the winged rat who they can use to tease their favorite fans the rabid Destiel lovers with their slash talk. They seem to get off on that.

[ravanne]

The only hope that I have right now that the remainder of the season doesn't turn into a total morass of Dean and Castiel exchanging meaningful glances while Sam is shuffled off to... somewhere else since he's obviously not as important as either of them is that Misha is not being accurate or honest in that interview. Misha has a history of pandering to his fans and mistating or overstating his character's role and actions. This is an actor who needs to work and wants to generate as much interest and excitement about his character's return so that maybe... just maybe... he's return on a permanent basis. I don't think that this is going to happen. Everything that we've heard from the writers is that the whole reason to bring Castiel back is to conclude the character's role in the show.

Though personally, I don't see the need for any additional conclusion. Why the show feels the need to revisit, yet again, Castiel and what it had done is beyond me. Especially since it seems to be that nothing that Castiel has done is going to be examined. The simple fact is that 99.9% of the hell that the Winchesters are going through now is a direct result of what Castiel did, yet Castiel's actions are never called into question and it is never held accountable for what it has done. The idea of Castiel basically being absolved for releasing the Leviathans (which lead to Bobby's death) and breaking Sam's wall (leading to Sam losing his sanity), not to mention all of the other deaths and betrayals it directly caused because it is "changed" sickens me. This isn't Castiel being given a chance to redeem itself (which is something I don't want but can tolerate), but basically everything Castiel's done being handwaved away. After all, how can you hold someone responsible for what it did when it has no memory of those actions? It's a convenient way to just erase all of its past misdeeds.

As horrible as this is for Sam's storyline (since it's now clearly obvious that Sam's storyline, such as it is, has come to a screaching halt), it is far worse for Dean's. This is a total perversion of Dean's character and all that they have spent six seasons developing. It would be the equivelant of John forgiving YED for murdering his wife and pushing him and his sons into the dangerous life of a hunter just because YED was "different". That Dean would welcome Castiel's return, in whatever capacity, for anything more than a chance to save Sam distorts everything that Dean is. And it places Castiel's role in Dean's life as being more important than Sam, Bobby, and even Dean himself. Dean would be the equivilent of a battered woman who just can't stop from returning to the one who keeps hurting her. The excuse (and it is an excuse) that Castiel has "changed" is nothing more than a way to erase the past.

Unfortunately for me, I just can't forget what Castiel did, or the fact that it has never once owned up to its actions, or been held responsible for what its done. There has been no self-examination or honest reflection, by Castiel or anyone around it. Even in TMWWBK, it was more about Castiel justifying its actions rather than having any serious questions about the harm it has done to those around it. This is a being that had a direct hand in setting the Apocalypse in motion, had only a minor supportive role in preventing it, betrayed those that it called its friends in the cruelest manners possible and completely on its own unleased a horror on the world that rivals anything that Lucifer could accomplish. Everything that has happened since the Leviathans were released - all the innocent humans that were slaughtered as a result - are the direct responsibility of Castiel. Yet unlike Sam, who accepted full ownership of his mistakes, it appears that Castiel's will be handwaved away.

Damn... I am so depressed and disgusted with this turn of events.

[shadowhund]

Ravanne, I sent you a pm...

[shadowhund]

Mar 10, 2012 8:02:30 GMT -5 chloekins said:

Mar 10, 2012 7:48:12 GMT -5 shadowhund said:

oh yeah, Ravanne I hear you too!!!

Sorry for my rant, I have to write this down...
We get kicked with the favorite Winchester and we get shoved in our throats that the people can talk to him more and relate to him more and like him more and in the same time Sam is not around, standing in the corner, silently, all alone!! Even Dean is not talking with him. Dean has his own things going on and meets and greets everyone on the planet, seemingly including his "BB" and "lost brother" Castiel!

Sam OTOH is quiete about himself, about what is going on with him and we even don't get scenes where someone talks with him about him or gives a reaction to the person, they disconnecting Sam from the viewers!!

I am now at this point that I don't need Dean to be around Sam anymore, Dean can go with Castiel elsewhere and lean on him for support, when I get equal time with Sam's journey, troubles, insight in him, people around him who care for Sam, loves him, likes him and he can have human connections! I don't care for hell memories I want to see Sam forefront and equal!

Sadly for me is the fact I don't need Dean around Sam anymore, when they don't talk with each other like brothers/family they once were...

I also thought that when they stopped thinking and caring about Sam, the character (the writers, showrunners), let him be at least the big bad lonesome wolf next year, so he has impact and Jared has something to do (but I don't know how I would handle this scenario). Then he can kill Castiel with his powers, and Dean can hunt him down finally for hurting his touchy-feely new family! Yes, am sarcastic!

But maybe we get Dean back being a brother and stone number one to Sam! But that would mean Dean would have to be at his brothers side and really looking at him and asking him and talking WITH him! Because I can only find out about Sam when Dean talks to him, or Lucifer! They have no clue how else they could give us Sam insight or they don't want to or they simply don't care!

Maybe Dean has changed when he was in hell that much that he is regretting that he ever made the deal in the first place! And he is resenting Sam for this, not openly, but in some weird brain connection!

And I say this even when I think the brothers relationship is the heart of the show, but the heart is dead and not nurtured since a long time on my screen!

Shadow this is excellent. I agree 100%. I'm so mad at Dean right now so I'm with you. Let Dean go off with his soul mate Cas and leave Sam alone. Sam will be better off by himself. If the writers are trying to make us sympathetic to Dean's suffering they're failing or Jensen is because he's coming across as just totally selfish.

I'm mourning so much the wonderful brotherness and magical relationship between Sam and Dean from early days. It's gone and doesn't seem likely to come back. The writers are so stupid to throw that away for their new star of the show the winged rat who they can use to tease their favorite fans the rabid Destiel lovers with their slash talk. They seem to get off on that.

Yeah Chloe!! I would love to write something different about Dean, but the foreshadowing of the events started already at the convention before the last one!! I was...huh...what did Jensen say about the winged rat....Dean has his back and Castiel his.... Then I thought well Jensen can only tell us a bit, he doesn't know more (like Jared didn't know about Ruby till to the very last episode in S4) But when the writers wants to give the rabid fans redemption for the thing who harmed so much and is even not a human being....the outcome of my wishful scenario is getting smaller and smaller! or and not especially with the lack of Sam and the whitewashing of this supernatural being. Dean is then unrecognizable and totally ruined for me!

When Dean has to decide to be with his brother or this being it should be his brother. Somehow I remember S4 very strong now where Sam tried to kill Lilllith with Ruby and in the end Ruby misguided and manipulated Sam to release the devil! Sam begged Dean to come with him...with Ruby....Dean didn't want to go with Ruby together! He denied to work with her, I imagine the same scenario with Dean and Castiel now but Sam doesn't want to work with that being, but the end result will be that Dean can trust this being (who hurt his brother), is right like always and Sam stands there in the corner doesn't go with them to fight against the Levis!

[chloekins]

Mar 10, 2012 11:13:25 GMT -5 shadowhund said:

Mar 10, 2012 8:02:30 GMT -5 chloekins said:

Shadow this is excellent. I agree 100%. I'm so mad at Dean right now so I'm with you. Let Dean go off with his soul mate Cas and leave Sam alone. Sam will be better off by himself. If the writers are trying to make us sympathetic to Dean's suffering they're failing or Jensen is because he's coming across as just totally selfish.

I'm mourning so much the wonderful brotherness and magical relationship between Sam and Dean from early days. It's gone and doesn't seem likely to come back. The writers are so stupid to throw that away for their new star of the show the winged rat who they can use to tease their favorite fans the rabid Destiel lovers with their slash talk. They seem to get off on that.

Yeah Chloe!! I would love to write something different about Dean, but the foreshadowing of the events started already at the convention before the last one!! I was...huh...what did Jensen say about the winged rat....Dean has his back and Castiel his.... Then I thought well Jensen can only tell us a bit, he doesn't know more (like Jared didn't know about Ruby till to the very last episode in S4) But when the writers wants to give the rabid fans redemption for the thing who harmed so much and is even not a human being....the outcome of my wishful scenario is getting smaller and smaller! or and not especially with the lack of Sam and the whitewashing of this supernatural being. Dean is then unrecognizable and totally ruined for me!

When Dean has to decide to be with his brother or this being it should be his brother. Somehow I remember S4 very strong now where Sam tried to kill Lilllith with Ruby and in the end Ruby misguided and manipulated Sam to release the devil! Sam begged Dean to come with him...with Ruby....Dean didn't want to go with Ruby together! He denied to work with her, I imagine the same scenario with Dean and Castiel now but Sam doesn't want to work with that being, but the end result will be that Dean can trust this being (who hurt his brother), is right like always and Sam stands there in the corner doesn't go with them to fight against the Levis!

I agree with all you said. I'm so disgusted with Dean right now which I never thought I ever could be. His brother has saved his life countless times, been there with him through every horrible event in their lives, crawled across broken glass in order to receive forgivness from Dean, tolerated Dean's snarky treatment during that time, but yet Dean thinks that Cas has his back and Dean has his. That's just great.

I would have more respect for Sam if he did stand up to Dean and say enough. I won't interact with the monster who destroyed my mind. You have to choose, him or me. And then walk away. I would cheer if Sam did that.

[ravanne]

Over on SpoilerTV, they have the spoiler pictures from TBAI and steel yourselves folks. We have pictures of either Dean alone, or Dean with Castiel in the car with Castiel riding shotgun. It was taking all of my control not to throw my laptop across the room in disgust. Not a single picture of Sam to even hint that he's in the episode at all, let alone has any kind of meaningful part.

I really hate how Dean's character has been all but destroyed in the past few seasons. This was a guy for whom family was everything and worth sacrificing your life and soul for. This was a confident hunter who loved his life, loved how he was able to help people and loved the adventure that his life brought. Now he's indecisive, uncertain and all but completely lost at sea. The writers cannibalized Sam's canon history to give Dean a desire for a normal life, a hunger for hearth and home. John went from being a beloved and idolized figure to Dean to being the ultimate dead beat father deserving of no regard (nevermind the fact that John sacrificed his soul to save Dean). The Dean of seasons 1-3 would be kicking season 4-7 Dean's ass all across the country for his stupidity. And any indecision about trusting Castiel in whatever incarnation the winged rat returns in just shows how far Dean has fallen.

I don't care if Dean is the last human being on the face of the planet and has no one but a pet cockroach to turn to for emotional support. Castiel in no way should ever be trusted again. Castiel didn't make a "mistake" as its appologists keep insisting. It betrayed Dean in the worst way possible. Anything more than Dean chosing to use Castiel to help Sam before shoving an angel-killing blade through its throat and salting and burning its worthless carcass so that it never haunts us again will be a betrayal of everything that Dean has stood for.

[chloekins]

Mar 13, 2012 9:32:32 GMT -5 ravanne said:

Over on SpoilerTV, they have the spoiler pictures from TBAI and steel yourselves folks. We have pictures of either Dean alone, or Dean with Castiel in the car with Castiel riding shotgun. It was taking all of my control not to throw my laptop across the room in disgust. Not a single picture of Sam to even hint that he's in the episode at all, let alone has any kind of meaningful part.

I really hate how Dean's character has been all but destroyed in the past few seasons. This was a guy for whom family was everything and worth sacrificing your life and soul for. This was a confident hunter who loved his life, loved how he was able to help people and loved the adventure that his life brought. Now he's indecisive, uncertain and all but completely lost at sea. The writers cannibalized Sam's canon history to give Dean a desire for a normal life, a hunger for hearth and home. John went from being a beloved and idolized figure to Dean to being the ultimate dead beat father deserving of no regard (nevermind the fact that John sacrificed his soul to save Dean). The Dean of seasons 1-3 would be kicking season 4-7 Dean's ass all across the country for his stupidity. And any indecision about trusting Castiel in whatever incarnation the winged rat returns in just shows how far Dean has fallen.

I don't care if Dean is the last human being on the face of the planet and has no one but a pet cockroach to turn to for emotional support. Castiel in no way should ever be trusted again. Castiel didn't make a "mistake" as its appologists keep insisting. It betrayed Dean in the worst way possible. Anything more than Dean chosing to use Castiel to help Sam before shoving an angel-killing blade through its throat and salting and burning its worthless carcass so that it never haunts us again will be a betrayal of everything that Dean has stood for.

Cheers!
You deserve a standing ovation.

Dean has turned into a whiney, selfish, woobie. Through the efforts and terrific acting of Jared and Jensen, we have the greatest brother relationship ever seen on TV but the writers are deliberately destroying it to promote a character which is probably the most poorly written, poorly acted ever on TV, just to pander to a small bunch of sick fans who get off on reading and writing slash fiction and because the writers get off on teasing these same fans with their sly little comments and innuendos.

I just can't believe Jensen enjoys seeing the character he's worked so hard to create turned into this cariacature or what he once was. It's disgusting.

[SoCal]

While I can't agree with everything you say Dean has become, some of it I am in complete agreement with.

I'm sure the writers/creators would say that both characters have changed over the years. As they've gotten older and gone through awful experiences, we couldn't expect them to stay exactly like they were when season 1 started.

Dean has changed. His experiences in Hell have driven that change. I think he was profoundly affected by the fact that he didn't hold up under Alistair's torture and began to torture others. And not just torture, but enjoy doing it. Remember what he told Castiel after being told to torture Alistair, that "he wouldn't like what came out of that room." And in IATL, Zachariah wanted to show him that he was meant to be a hunter, that his life was more meaninful as a hunter than as a business executive.

But I do agree that the writers seem to be portraying him more and more as a non-too bright tough guy who only relies on brawn to complete whatever task he has in front of him. We all know that his character was originally written as a smart, strong and cocky hunter. That's a change I don't like.

Oh well, I'm hoping as season 7 goes along, we may see a return to smart Dean. But I'm not holding my breath.

[windykl]

ravanne and chloekins--i LOVE reading your posts...ya'll say what i'm thinking!!!!

the problem with the writers/tptb is they don't think there's anything wrong with the way the brother's are written....i'm preparing myself for cas' redemption and dean's forgiveness of him...and i'm wondering if he'll be back in s8 now...i mean all anyone is talking about for ep 17 is cas/misha's return....of course, i still don't know why they're even bringing him back...

[chloekins]

Mar 13, 2012 21:55:53 GMT -5 windykl said:

ravanne and chloekins--i LOVE reading your posts...ya'll say what i'm thinking!!!!

the problem with the writers/tptb is they don't think there's anything wrong with the way the brother's are written....i'm preparing myself for cas' redemption and dean's forgiveness of him...and i'm wondering if he'll be back in s8 now...i mean all anyone is talking about for ep 17 is cas/misha's return....of course, i still don't know why they're even bringing him back...

This person, Cadlymack is a Cas lover and a blogger or a entertainment journalist, I'm really not sure. But she gets interviews and set visits and she recently interviewed Misha. She tweeted this supposedly reassuring little nugget which is supposed to make all Sam lovers feel so MUCH better.

Sam girls, relax. No pics of Jared yet for 3/23 ep, but the whole Castiel/Dean story is ABOUT saving Sam. He's not, like, discarded. #SPN

I know the storyline for season 8. Sam disappears and Dean and Cas hunt for him. That way it's all about Sam even though he's never seen. I tell ya I just want to throw things at these stupid people.

[windykl]

Mar 14, 2012 3:51:19 GMT -5 chloekins said:

Mar 13, 2012 21:55:53 GMT -5 windykl said:

ravanne and chloekins--i LOVE reading your posts...ya'll say what i'm thinking!!!!

the problem with the writers/tptb is they don't think there's anything wrong with the way the brother's are written....i'm preparing myself for cas' redemption and dean's forgiveness of him...and i'm wondering if he'll be back in s8 now...i mean all anyone is talking about for ep 17 is cas/misha's return....of course, i still don't know why they're even bringing him back...

This person, Cadlymack is a Cas lover and a blogger or a entertainment journalist, I'm really not sure. But she gets interviews and set visits and she recently interviewed Misha. She tweeted this supposedly reassuring little nugget which is supposed to make all Sam lovers feel so MUCH better.

Sam girls, relax. No pics of Jared yet for 3/23 ep, but the whole Castiel/Dean story is ABOUT saving Sam. He's not, like, discarded. #SPN

I know the storyline for season 8. Sam disappears and Dean and Cas hunt for him. That way it's all about Sam even though he's never seen. I tell ya I just want to throw things at these stupid people.

cadlymack hasn't interviewed misha yet....he was supposed to have a round table interview session on monday with some journalists, but was cancelled due to him being called back to vancouver early....i know she LOVES jared and fangirls over him and spn is her favorite show....now she did interview jared/jensen in vancouver about a month ago so i think that's where she's getting her info....

i hope he's not in s8...tbh, i agree with you that sam disappears when cas is on show...and that is not acceptable to me at all!! my fear is they think that all spn fans want cas back--during jensen's recent M&G, he mentioned them making spn for the fans now---maybe that's why he keeps mentioning bringing all these characters back..he thinks it's what the fans wants....

but i am impressed with how people are tweeting the journalist, even jim to express their displeasure with cas coming back..of course, jim doesn't respond cuz he loves misha and cas, that's my theory anyway, lol

[ravanne]

I could probably tolerate Castiel's presence if it weren't for the fact that there is no balance in the storytelling between Sam and Dean. Dean is the only that everyone loves and rallies around while Sam is more or less only tolerated. Dean is Bobby's favorite serrogate son (stated outright under the truth spell back in YCHTT). Ellen's spirit communicates with Dean to encourage him while Sam has the hell memories perculating in his head and gets nothing. Dean gets the final touching moments with the people that they rescue (even if Sam is ultimately the one who does the saving, but what does that matter?). Dean is the one who gets a pet angel that he shares a "profound bond' with, and what does Sam get? A snarky Lucifer haunting his brain and reminding him of being tortured and raped for over a century. Yeah... that's fair. *rolls eyes*

I know that the EDGs and ECGs are sick of hearing this (too bad!), but there has been absoluely no balance in giving both the main characters focus in several years now. Dean's storyline is Dean's storyline and Sam's storyline mostly now ends up being about Dean and how it affects him. We are now well past the halfway mark this season and has gotten only a single episode that really clues us in on just what Sam is dealing with. And from the begining of this season, the primary focus for what is happening to Sam has been viewed through a prism on how it affects Dean. That was Bobby's first concern after Sam's collapse in MTNB - how was this impacting on Dean, who already had so much to Deal with.

Castiel's return just at the point where the focus was supposed to finally shift to Sam and give his storyline some real attention could not come at a worse time. Again, the storyline might be about saving Sam on the surface, but the emotional meat of the storyline will be about Dean and whatever bond he has with Castiel. That has been the media focus, the focus of all the spoilers and all the excitment about this phase of the season. Sam doesn't even get the scraps of storytelling any longer. Now his whole storyline is going to be reduced to giving Castiel a means toward redemption (as if fixing one thing that it broke makes up for all the other deaths that it directly caused, Bobby's included).

Had Sam's storyline been given proper focus, and had the SPN universe and everyone in it not completely revolved around Dean and Dean alone, I might not be as angry and offended as I am now. But this is going to be another example of what happenes to Sam being far less about Sam than Dean or Castiel. And Sam will be reduced to wallpaper or a plot device yet again.